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[Proposal] Learning skills solution

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Rip Minner Gallente ARMITAGE Logistics Salvage and Industries	Posted - 2010.06.06 11:58:00 - [1] Edited by: Rip Minner on 06/06/2010 12:01:45 I dont support this. So far I have not seen one good resion to remove them. And only bad ideals on how to go about it. This has zero to do with new players. There is a point as a new player were you have to come to grips with the fact your never going to be on the same sp level as all the older players. That is what turns new players away not the learning skills themself they just make them face that fact sooner reather then later. Secondly is I dont want eve to be like all the other mmo's man. I dont want to race to a cap level. I hated that alot. I like that fact there is no cap level and that they keep adding more skills all the time so you always have something to work on in the skills part of eve. Lastly you truely dont need massive sp to compet in one single thing. You just need to train the right sp pool for what you plan to be doing. And pick something that you will like doing for a spell as it will take time to train the right sp pool to go and do something alse. Edit: Eve is not a instant gradifaction game its a game were you have to take time to evolve your toon. Dont jack with the balance or the force will bite us all in the rear. Is it a rock? Point a Lazer at it and profit. Is it a ship? Point a Lazer at it and profit. I dont realy see any differnces here.
Rip Minner Gallente ARMITAGE Logistics Salvage and Industries	Posted - 2010.06.07 01:18:00 - [2] Originally by: Kaya Divine Originally by: Rip Minner Edited by: Rip Minner on 06/06/2010 12:01:45 So far I have not seen one good resion to remove them. And only bad ideals on how to go about it. Yet again I will underline the fact that we dont discuss here about should they be removed...because its something CCP is working on. But about what will happen, and whats the best solution for theirs removal. Link the devblog or gtfo. They have talked about mybe pulling them for years but they have not and will not. Why becouse its not realy a problem and two they cant find a good way to realy do this so its never going to happen. They my think or talk about it here and there for 8 more years to come but I would not bet on it happening any time soon. Is it a rock? Point a Lazer at it and profit. Is it a ship? Point a Lazer at it and profit. I dont realy see any differnces here.
Rip Minner Gallente ARMITAGE Logistics Salvage and Industries	Posted - 2010.06.07 07:09:00 - [3] Originally by: Liang Nuren Originally by: Rip Minner Link the devblog or gtfo. They have talked about mybe pulling them for years but they have not and will not. Why becouse its not realy a problem and two they cant find a good way to realy do this so its never going to happen. They my think or talk about it here and there for 8 more years to come but I would not bet on it happening any time soon. First, would you mind reading the thread before you go off flaming? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VAgUwEztj28#t=38m40s Second, learning skills basically present us with these two options: 1. People log in and they spend time training other skills so that they can train skills. This significantly delays their ability to train real skills - no matter if they train their skills all at once ("best result") or interspersed ("80/20 result"). 2. People log in and train real skills. The proper solution is ALWAYS going to be #2 from a new player's perspective. And as a corp CEO (not that we recruit noobs...), I'd really prefer #2 as well. AND I DON'T EVEN GIVE A **** IF THEY GIVE ME MY SP BACK IN ANY WAY. But dammit learning skills do nothing but detract from the game. Remove them already. -Liang Are you kiding me this video. Man you could cut a video from every time they touch on the subject of newbies and learning skills. And that was what in 2009 were havle way though 2010. You got to see its the same old song and dance. It ant going to happen anytime soon. Is it a rock? Point a Lazer at it and profit. Is it a ship? Point a Lazer at it and profit. I dont realy see any differnces here.
Rip Minner Gallente ARMITAGE Logistics Salvage and Industries	Posted - 2010.06.09 07:31:00 - [4] Edited by: Rip Minner on 09/06/2010 07:37:28 Edited by: Rip Minner on 09/06/2010 07:32:19 Originally by: Liang Nuren Originally by: Rip Minner Are you kiding me this video. Man you could cut a video from every time they touch on the subject of newbies and learning skills. And that was what in 2009 were havle way though 2010. You know, in the life of a game where WIS has been a planned expansion for 4 years and it took 2 years for the latest nano nerf to hit... 1 year isn't so long. Hell its only 2 expansion cycles for a problem they admitted was difficult to solve - mostly because sticks in the mud like you want people wasting time with learning skills instead of jumping right into the game. -Liang No your wrong I would love for them to refund my sp's and I would take full advanage of starting sleeper accounts for R&D datacores. I'm just saying it ant going to happen anytime soon. You see there are more problems then just giving the sp's to people that already trained this skills it removes alot of barrers for older players to explot too. Edit whats to stop older players from starting a fresh Training first thing for +% implants and speed training to R&D on the toons one account and just sleeping it. Nothing and You can now do it in so much faster if you bypass learning skills. Is it a rock? Point a Lazer at it and profit. Is it a ship? Point a Lazer at it and profit. I dont realy see any differnces here.
Rip Minner Gallente ARMITAGE Logistics Salvage and Industries	Posted - 2010.06.16 02:01:00 - [5] Originally by: Takashi Halamoto Alot of the people not supporting dont seem to be able to read or read half a line and red mist decended CCP WILL GET RID OF LEARNING SKILLS - THEY ONLY NEED TO FIND A SOLUTION THEN THEY WILL DO IT ergo there is no arguing for learning skills, they will go as soon as ccp has a solution or says to hell with it and just abolishes them and angers the players because they couldnt get a supported solution I SUPPORT GIVE ALL CHARACTERS +10 TO ALL STATS because that increases the divisor for skill learning by 15 for all pilots, and what is a big barrier to new players is the time it takes for them to train up reasonable skills, a flat boost in stats to everyone wont affect the old vets who have +8 - +10 in all stats from learning anyway, but will significantly improve the training time of skills for all players under 1yr old helping them get the skills needed to start doing more faster REMEMBER THIS IS ABOUT GIVING CCP AN OPTION THAT DOSNT JUST SIMPLY REMOVE THEM AND ANNOY EVERYONE I dont care and probly most dont care about the if they add stats to all or boost training times. What realy maters for us older players the trained them up is geting to spend thoughs sp's right now on the skills we want them in. Becouse we already spent that time training. Not only that we have +5mil sp's in max training skills but when we trained them it was a much longer training time to get up to them. So the real deal here is do we just give them the +5mil sp's they have in there training skills are do we also rembust them and addital amout of sp's for all the time they spent training learning skills with out max learning skills to help them train them? I say remburs all learning skills SP + 10% sp as compistion. And let that pilot pick were he wants to place the sp right at that moment he logs in to his toon. Is it a rock? Point a Lazer at it and profit. Is it a ship? Point a Lazer at it and profit. I dont realy see any differnces here.
Rip Minner Gallente ARMITAGE Logistics Salvage and Industries	Posted - 2010.08.07 09:42:00 - [6] Not supported. I dont see anything wrong with it. If it's not broken then leave it alone. Becouse we have a long list of things that are broken. Is it a rock? Point a Lazer at it and profit. Is it a ship? Point a Lazer at it and profit. I dont realy see any differnces here.
Rip Minner Gallente ARMITAGE Logistics Salvage and Industries	Posted - 2010.08.18 04:08:00 - [7] Originally by: Xorv Originally by: JinRogh Not supported if you cant handle learning skills EVE isn't the game for you. Go play Wow with all the other impatient children.If they have to mess with the learning skills give every new player lvl 3 in all learning skills like it said in the evelopedia page I wont be happy but it wont ruin the game either. I wanna be a physicist without going to school!! I wanna be a truck driver without getting my CDL!! How many "Learning Classes" have you taken in real life? In EVE if you want to be a Physicist you can learn Science and Physics. We don't have trucks in EVE, but if you want to fly an Industrial ship you learn the appropriate piloting skills in Space Ship Command. So WTF are learning skills? They're a time sink nothing more, there's no real correlation with learning things in real life. Before you post next time I recommend you take a basic reasoning class because like most of the pro learning skill posters your arguments are terrible and make no sense. But if you really think it would help ask at your local college/uni if you can take "the learning class" instead. Xorv I have taken class that teach you how to take notes in class and classes that teach you how to teach yourself and classes that teach you how to take test. So I would have to say that there are learning skills in real life and classes for thoughs skills. Is it a rock? Point a Lazer at it and profit. Is it a ship? Point a Lazer at it and profit. I dont realy see any differnces here.
Rip Minner Gallente ARMITAGE Logistics Salvage and Industries	Posted - 2010.08.18 04:20:00 - [8] Originally by: Xorv Edited by: Xorv on 14/08/2010 01:10:18 Originally by: KaarBaak Irony is a *****. KB Really? Perhaps you'd care to explain how what I said is in any way ironic? Or are you just another dumb troll that I ought to ignore? I think she is pointing out that ""Before you post next time I recommend you take a basic reasoning class... "" would probly be a learning class. Is it a rock? Point a Lazer at it and profit. Is it a ship? Point a Lazer at it and profit. I dont realy see any differnces here.
Rip Minner Gallente ARMITAGE Logistics Salvage and Industries	Posted - 2010.08.18 04:23:00 - [9] Originally by: Uriel Winston / Supported you know when i was a newbie i wanted to train for some ships, a little catalyst later a thorax and since i wasn't in a corp no one told me about learning skills... so i had wasted all 1.6m sp bonus in training skills i could have got 1000% faster if i trained learning skills. reimburse or just make the SP vanish. dont care but its completely stupid to train skills that will make you train other skills faster. READING A BOOK DOESN'T MAKE YOU READ THE NEXT ONE FASTER Mybe not but there are learning classes in real life that can teach you to read faster learn faster and test faster and get better grades. Is it a rock? Point a Lazer at it and profit. Is it a ship? Point a Lazer at it and profit. I dont realy see any differnces here.
Rip Minner Gallente ARMITAGE Logistics Salvage and Industries	Posted - 2010.09.03 03:52:00 - [10] Originally by: Newbee NOT supporting... there are people ingame that had to wait and proof patience ( what is a big part about eve in general from my point of view ) to train them all up to level 5 ... it would be really unfair to those who did that and no just reassigning the SP to other skills is NOT a solution for this for one good reason... some people trained them to level 5 to have a bonus in long term... other did NOT train them up but other skills instead and will now recieve the same bonus??? ... these are the wishes of people that just dont have the patience to wait training skills... --> NO plz DONT do this Quoted for truth! Is it a rock? Point a Lazer at it and profit. Is it a ship? Point a Lazer at it and profit. I dont realy see any differnces here.

Rip Minner Gallente ARMITAGE Logistics Salvage and Industries	Posted - 2010.09.19 18:30:00 - [11] Edited by: Rip Minner on 19/09/2010 18:34:33 I dont want them removed. But the fact that CCP as let CSM put it in the "In Process" on the mins and the fact that they showed a real tool for leting players place skill points were they wish. Makes be belive that its realy in the In Process and CCP is for real this time. As much as I hate thinking about that I will post how I would like it to go down. ò1. Add 10 points + 10% to all characters attributes 10 points is the value of maxed learning skills, 10% is a bonus to value gained by maxed Learning skill. ò2. Remove all learning skills. Like they never existed. ò3. SP which player had been invested in Learning skills will probly be be given back to the player just like they did before with the server down. And they will probly give you all SP's in all Learning skills form all 3 toons but I think the tool is limited in that if you have max learning skills on all 3 toons thats 15mil+ sp's that all 15mil + sp's will be giving to the toon with the most skill points. I think its becouse the tool is limited to giving it to only one toon on the account and the main toon is normly the one with the most sp's so thats why. Thats just what I belive by want was seen of the tool before. My main accout is just like that all 3 toons have max learning skills and +5 implants for fast learning. Thats 16,128,000 sp's. going to my main toon. Can we say instant Cap Pilot lolz. This is how I look at 16mil sp's as 16mons worth of training time. At max learning and +5 implants I train over 1mil sp's each month. My main toon will jump ahead 16mons worth of training time. So this mite not be all that bad and it will make is super easy to train my alt toons on my other account. As before I always spent the first 3-4 mons training first for +5 implants and then max learning skills now I can just train for +5 implants and jump right to what I want my alt to be doing. Is it a rock? Point a Lazer at it and profit. Is it a ship? Point a Lazer at it and profit. I dont realy see any differnces here.
Rip Minner Gallente ARMITAGE Logistics Salvage and Industries	Posted - 2010.09.24 06:05:00 - [12] Edited by: Rip Minner on 24/09/2010 06:12:44 Edited by: Rip Minner on 24/09/2010 06:08:34 Originally by: DALLAM Edited by: DALLAM on 23/09/2010 19:18:30 Edited by: DALLAM on 23/09/2010 19:18:02 This is what I propose as a solution: A Modifier Level 5 Learning Level. Cut the max learning level to level 4, which would give the player the same maximum training speed as level 5. The last level (level 5) gives the player a 3% increase in whatever attribute is used for a particular job. For instance, if a primary attribute on a particular weapon is Intelligence, then you would get a 3% increase in damage for having Intelligence at level 5. The secondary attribute would add another 2%--if it were level 5 also--for a total modifier of 5%. And in order to make it something that would entice newer players to strive for w/o making the game unnecessarily hard in the beginning, is to double or triple the training time of that last level from where it is now. That way you have maximum training speed after level 4, and you don't have to train the modifier level until you are further into game play, while that last modifier level takes a really long time to train, and would be considered an elite skill for advanced players. I like this ideal but I had level 4 skills before I had level 5 skills. Belive it or not thoughs 2 points make a noticeable differnts. So I would not wish to lose them. You have 3% and 2% thats 5%. 5% over 10 levels worth of skill could be simply added as 0.5% each level and would make each level trained more usefull and mybe even fun too. This is hands down the best ideal I have seen to date. This is what I would do to make everyone happy or happyer. Edit: 5% my be to much or to little so what ever is ok with max skills just spread it out over all 10 levels. You mite even or probly would wieght it out so you got better or more benift from the higher ranking learning skills too. Edit2: Another good ideal to make them usefull more then they are is adding them as preq. On some iteams or other skills. Notable would be Socal skills for trading/Socal skills. Int/Memory for Sciance i.e. I aways belive it's better to fix content then to remove it. Is it a rock? Point a Lazer at it and profit. Is it a ship? Point a Lazer at it and profit. I dont realy see any differnces here.

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